Worse Than Guantanamo?

[goat balls]

Compared to the Palais de Justice in Paris, Guantanamo looks like ClubMed. I guess the German media will be furious about this blatant French disregard of human rights, as they are in the case of Guantanamo... This will be a media firestorm! Heh heh.

Or not....

Cells at France's Palais de Justice condemned as 'squalid and inhumane dungeons'

The European Council's commissioner for human rights has described conditions in the prison in France's most august court building as the worst he has seen. ...

Alvaro Gil-Robles said the cells in the historic Palais de Justice in Paris were squalid and inhumane.

Describing them as "dungeons", he said: "It is incredible that people are imprisoned in such conditions, without ventilation and without natural light. I have never seen a worse prison." Mr Gil-Robles, 60, an academic lawyer and Spain's former national ombudsman, spent 16 days in France last month inspecting prisons, detention centres and mental hospitals.

The palais is situated on the beautiful L'île de la Cité, a few hundred yards from Notre Dame cathedral. But in its "dépôt", human rights organisations have uncovered evidence of prisoners, mainly illegal immigrants, going without food, drink and lavatory paper as they huddle together for warmth. There have been numerous violent attacks and cases of detainees mutilating themselves and smearing their blood on the walls.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/10/10/wpris10.xml&sSheet=/news/2005/10/10/ixworld.html

[Johnno]

Im curious to see how people screaming about abu gharib and Guantanamo take this.

[Kurt]

As someone who screams about Abu Gharaib and Guantanomo I dislike this.

But my tax dollars are not paying for it, that is the big difference.

How did you think someone like me would respond?

[goat balls]

Ahhhh....Monsieur Kurt. Tax dollars...I never would've thought of it that way.

Very clever way of looking at it really.

[Ultra Swain]

Im curious to see how people screaming about abu gharib and Guantanamo take this.

What's your point? So France tortures people so no one can complain about Gitmo or Abu Ghraib? It all sucks, and all the electrocution and beatings and pointing at hooded peoples junk hasn't gotten any closer to winning the GWOT. Can you not be an apologist long enough to admit that maybe that kind of treatment is wrong?

[Penta]

3 points:

1. We have a commissioner for HR who visits countries (including their prisons), produces reports and holds them to account. Bush and Gonzales reckon they're above the law in Guantanamo and are not accountable to anyone.

2. The report hasn't been published yet, so we don't know the details. I've only been able to find the short Telegraph article you quoted and an extract from a Le Monde article which requires subscription.

3. For all we know, the people may only be held in the cells while waiting for their court appearance before being transferred back to normal prisons (or released). Whatever, they are part of a system with due process (unlike Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib, Bagram etc.).

Still disgraceful, but presumably improvements will now be made.

[kgb]

Holy shit! So you're telling me that France is just as bad as the U.S.? What am I going to call my julienned potatoes now?

[fish-e]

Julien has taken a hiatus from making potatoes. You may now refer to them as Jean-Paul, Jean-Marc or Jean-Claude Potatoes, depending on who is working that day.

[Kurt]

Holy shit! So you're telling me that France is just as bad as the U.S.? What am I going to call my julienned potatoes now?

Torture Fries.

[Buzzsaw]

A lot of California wines are now as good as some Bordeauxs and Burgundies, so the Frogs are trying to beat us at our own game.

[Kurt]

A lot of California wines are now as good as some Bordeauxs and Burgundies, so the Frogs are trying to beat us at our own game.

California is an agriculture machine.

But the problem I have with Cali wines is that they are too "oakey" which is great at parties and maybe with a light snack. But the Frogs and Dagos got the right acidity to actually make a real meal taste good.

This is why I often say "fuck it" and drink beer instead.

[Buzzsaw]

But the problem I have with Cali wines is that they are too "oakey" which is great at parties and maybe with a light snack. But the Frogs and Dagos got the right acidity to actually make a real meal taste good.

This is why I often say "fuck it" and drink beer instead.

I too had this same belief. But in August I met my brother in LA and we drove up the PCH and the 101 to the Oregon border, and I became a convert. Along the way we stopped in the Santa Ynez Valley, the Sonoma, the Napa, the Russian River and a couple of others. We must have tasted 100 or more wines. Absolutely fantastic. The vine-growing conditions is California are actually superior to France and probably Italy too. It's just a matter of them getting their recipes right. I added more wines to my collection than I could carry back. I had to ship a couple of cases.

I highly recommend this tour. And California has to be the prettiest stretch of real estate in the country, if not the world. Next summer, I'll do it in Bordeaux and Chianti and compare and contrast my findings.

All right, this may be the gayest post ever on a website dedicated to dangerous places.

In a dangerous place: seeking the perfect Zinfandel in the Sonoma Valley.

[Kurt]

I have heard that the problem might be with the barrels. cali barrels are to new.

I used to deliver art to the wineries up there and got offered free tours after delivery.

But the DUI level for me as a CDL holder would have been .004 % or a tad over one glass of wine.

Really frustrating. Especially at Clos Pegas.

[Buzzsaw]

That sucks. Next time you're out there have someone else drive. Preferably in a convertible. That's what we rented.

[kilroy]

tell you what, next time you're out there renting convertables, just let me know, and i'll pop on down.