nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby nowonmai » Wed Jan 20, 2016 9:58 am

You are the one using enhanced understanding through proximity to support your argument (crap approach by the way but you picked it) so how long have you lived in Germany, when did you first go there and what familial relationships do you have with any Germans?

Poll closed. Dry your eyes then princess.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby snaark » Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:16 am

In other words you've never been here, don't speak the language and have no idea what you're talking about.

I've lived here for 10 years.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby seektravelinfo » Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:33 pm

[quote="snaark"]Clearly you didn't look too hard at the site. Here's another article they published:

[quote]Give Women the Right to Defend Themselves
by [b][u]Geert Wilders[/u][/b] and Machiel de Graaf
January 13, 2016 at 10:30 am
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7219/ ... al-assault[/quote]

If the only way you can understand German behaviour is by rationalising it in terms of postwar guilt then you really ought to read more, and not websites of bullshit xenophobic "thinktanks".[/quote]


Well, doll, this one is from the Guardian, and remains relevant.




[b]The loneliness of being German[/b]
In striving to exorcise their past Germans have surrendered their ability to love themselves and their country. Perhaps this is why they envy Ireland - a country they see as having all the emotions they have lost. German-Irish novelist Hugo Hamilton on a people still in denial

Hugo Hamilton
Monday 6 September 2004 22.08 EDT Last modified on Monday 18 January 2016 09.09 EST

In 1957, Heinrich Böll published his famous travel book Irisches Tagebuch, which was later translated as Irish Journal. The Irish hated it and the Germans loved it. For the Irish it had too many donkeys and stone walls, too much dreaming and backward innocence. For the Germans, however, it was precisely these simple things that became so attractive. They carried the book with them in their rucksacks, searching for a kind of emotional connection to the people and the landscape. It gave them a sense of innocence and belonging, an inner life of feelings that was denied to them in their own country.

In fact, it was not a book about Ireland at all, but a book about all the things that were missing in Germany. Ireland was abundant with elusive qualities such as soul, sadness, longing, timelessness, all the romance of liberation and freedom. The Irish lived like there was no tomorrow. There was music everywhere and drinking. And maybe it is exactly this intoxicating naturalism, this idealism of uncomplicated life, which appealed so much to the German mind. Ireland had the same iconic value as the Che Guevara poster on the bedroom wall.

Had Böll written the same book about Germany, it would no doubt have been shunned as fascist. On the cliffs of Moher, the German could find a sense of home that had no ideological associations. They could learn to play the tin whistle and even sing songs about freedom. Unlike the Irish, Germans abroad tend to forget where they come from. There is no German enclave in New York as there used to be. Where the Irish and the Italians always longed to be on the map, to he heard and not forgotten, the Germans longed to be invisible.

The emotional attachment to home, to the land, to the place in which you are born, is something hereditary that lies deep in the human psyche, which is why it could be so abused by Nazi ideology. The result of this abuse is the systematic denial ever since of any feelings of belonging, a denial that has become so pervasive in German consciousness that it has erased these human instincts almost completely.

Of course the Germans have feelings. They fall in love, they have desires like everyone else, they feel passionate about football and you can hear the odd person proclaim "I love Berlin" or "I love Bavaria". Of course they feel sadness and grief, compassion, friendship, the entire spectrum of human emotions. But there was always something missing too. They had no dream-life, at least not until the Wim Wenders movie Himmel über Berlin came out. Or maybe it started again when the Berlin wall came down, with people crying and embracing each other on the streets.

Up to now, Germans have trained themselves to feel no pain, no sense of loss, no compassion for themselves. Nowhere in the world was the father and son gap so wide as it was in Germany. From the late 60s, young people prosecuted their parents and reshaped the German conscience. All this was essential for German renewal, but it also led to a dislocation, a kind of orphaned state. In the process of exorcising the Nazi crimes, generations of Germans also denied their own heritage and severed an emotional link with their own people.

The hidden agony of this discontinuity has never been fully explored. In effect, they became a homeless people, and still are. The physical destruction of German cities, the occupation by foreign armies, was overcome by adapting and rebuilding. But the intellectual homelessness was more profound, and included a ruthless defection from anything that had a spiritual link with the German soul. There is an unacknowledged loneliness in being German.

It is right that Germans have turned their back on the arrogance of nationalism. They are the only people in the world who have so comprehensively examined their own past. They have been to hell and back with guilt, and their overriding sense of duty towards their victims is unheard of in any other society. Remembering the Holocaust has replaced the crucifixion of Christ as a leading icon in our society. Memorials have become religious sites that provide a new kind of holiness and guide us towards a fair and racially tolerant society. If there is such a thing as absolution, it is only by remembering and revisiting these sites.


But there is sometimes also the perception that the Germans are born with their heads turned backwards, that there is something which prevents emotional thought and forces them to be forever rational and watchful. There is a feeling that everything you say as a German has to be passed by the legal team first, that German expression is devoid of recklessness, that it lacks the essential ingredients of mischief and spontaneity.

Perhaps this is the great strength of German writing. Writers like such as Peter Handke and Thomas Bernhard were admired for the way they rebuilt the language from the foundations, while Boell re-examined the Germans in a series of moral case histories. No German can easily express mother-love, least of all writers.

A German journalist recently accused me of not being hard enough on my own father, saying that a German writer would be critically lynched for showing such sympathy towards his own parents. It is clear that the openness with which Irish writers such as Colm Toibin and John McGahern engage with family, with home, with nature and landscape, is quite different. Irish writers talk about their sense of place. Seamus Heaney's exploration of digging, for instance, would mean something else altogether in Germany. In Ireland, the bog reveals things that connect us to the past, whereas the German forests are full of self-accusing landmines.

On a visit to Dublin some time ago, Bernhard Schlink was asked if he could explain what was so special about the German concept of Heimat, or home, to which he answered simply that he was born in Hamburg and went to school there. Maybe it is not a priority for German writers, and his extraordinary book The Reader demonstrates this contemporary German view best of all, a book in which the main character's parents are unseen.

Could it be that the Germans are way ahead of other pre-modern societies where nationalism and homeland are still seen as virtues? Could the use of dreaming simply be obsolete in Germany? Artists such as Joseph Beuys famously mocked the German sense of home and home furnishings. But the intensity of German longing for Ireland also suggests that they still possess the same homing instinct as anyone else, only that they have trained themselves to suppress any potential patriotic links to their own origins. It's a rear-view blind spot which has erased their country from the emotional map.

Maybe that's a progression. Maybe German humility and remorse have become the new German virtues to replace love of your country and your people. Maybe this is what it means to be German, to have a clear, patriotism-free conscience. In Berlin's Potsdamer Platz, the ambitious new architectural plans were scaled down deliberately for fear of appearing too arrogant and mighty. With time, this quiet code of humility may have become the emotional core of the new German being. A sense of place no longer applies to the ground where you have your feet, but to a collection of books you've read, films you go to, people you meet, and what you remember.

On a reading tour in Germany, I recently asked students at a secondary school in the southern town of Otterberg if it meant anything to be German. Was there anything the Germans could be proud of? The students and teachers stared back in shock. Nobody knew what to say. I had explained to them that my German-Irish childhood in had been plagued by these questions of nationalism, the ebbing Irish nationalism on my father's side and the legacy of German nationalism which my mother experienced under nazism. I had outlined the language war into which I had been conscripted as a child, forced to speak only Irish and German, wearing Aran sweaters and lederhosen, forbidden from speaking English.

Maybe there is no such thing as a German national consciousness. Maybe the whole question of sovereignty is an anachronism and that the Germans have become the first true internationalists, with global tastes, speaking fluent English, at home everywhere in the world. But if nationhood is obsolete then so is identity. It would mean that there is no such thing as being German and that they possess no individuality, only the surrogate identities of Guinness T-shirts and being Irish in Irish pubs. Perhaps the Germans are in the process of going into exile, emigrating into a new global identity.


I felt like I had thrown a grenade into the school at Otterberg. Being German was not something they had thought much about before, it seemed, apart from the fact that they all had a German history and German postal addresses. I told them that I had been called a Kraut and a Nazi as a child, that I had been put on trial by other children and that I had also denied being German. I told them I had the feeling that being German was a forbidden identity, that I still have difficulty saying "we Germans" and would rather just say I was Irish. I asked them what they would say if they went on holiday and people called them Krauts and Nazis. Do you ignore it? Or do you make a joke of it and say "I'm a Kraut, and I'm proud", like the great moment in the film of Roddy Doyle's The Commitments.

Nobody could say a thing, until one young student finally stood up and said: "I'm a German-Israeli-Palestinian." She wore no headscarf and said she felt that she had a sense of belonging in all three places, but that she also felt homeless. Another student stood up and said he was Argentinian born, but living in Germany. He said the Germans could feel proud because their history had taught them to become the most tolerant nation in Europe. As an immigrant, he was in a position to say that Germans were welcoming and took in more immigrants than any other country. A teacher added that she felt proud that the Germans had not joined in with the war of occupation in Iraq.

Could this be something that would give Germans a sense of identity and make them less invisible, the fact that they have not entered into a war? Can the German conscience be seen as an achievement, a source of leadership in the world? Is this new global conscience something that will stop the loneliness of being German?
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby rickshaw92 » Wed Jan 20, 2016 11:26 pm

I read this and can't wait for a bunch of these poor downtrodden people to move into my hood.

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/01 ... al-worker/

A social worker working in an asylum centre in Hamburg has spoken out about the daily realities of her job, which includes death threats, sexual harassment, aggressive behaviour, forged documents, misogyny, verbal abuse and even physical assault. She has admitted to changing her dress and behaviour in order to stay safe from the migrants, 90 percent of whom she describes as “unpleasant”.

Having initially been fired up with enthusiasm for helping the “refugees,” she admits that she is seriously considering quitting, as are most of her colleagues, thanks to the daily litany of abuse they receive at the hands of ungrateful migrants.

“I applied for this job because it was exactly what I wanted to do,” she told German news channel N24. “When confirmation of the job arrived in my mailbox, I looked forward to starting like crazy; finally I could not only help in theory, but also really do something practical to help the refugees.

“I went in in high spirits on my first day at the initial reception centre.” Her job consists of assisting the 1,500 migrants staying in the centre with asylum applications and access to services such as medical health checks.

“Well, and then the first refugees came to my office… After the first few visits I realized that my very positive and idealistic notion of them and their behaviour was very different from the reality… Of course can’t generalize about all refugees under any circumstances, many of them are very friendly, very grateful, very willing to integrate, very happy here… But if I’m honest 90 percent of those who I meet are rather unpleasant.”

Describing the aggressive behaviour of the majority, she explained: “First, many of them are extremely demanding… They came to me and demanded that I immediately set them up with an apartment, a fancy car, and a really good job. When I told them this was not possible, they would become loud and very aggressive. An Afghan threatened to kill himself there and then [if I did not help him with these demands].

“One Arab yelled at a colleague of mine ‘We will behead you!’… Because of these and other things the police are with us several times a week.”

The migrants are also duplicitous, she said, often turning up with a number of false documents.

“They would come to me and tell a story which did not match their papers. I would check with my colleagues and then I would find out that just the day before, the refugees had been to them with a completely different story.

“There was, for example, a resident who came to me with a deportation notice addressed to himself. He wanted to know what would happen next. I explained it to him, and then he went away. Soon afterwards, he appeared in front of my colleague and showed completely new identity documents in a different name. He was then just moved to another camp.”

And they are unreliable, leading to problems within the system as part of the routine is setting medical appointments for the migrants to be screened.

“I make appointments for them, but they just do not show up. This happens so often that the doctors have now asked us not to book as many appointments – but what am I supposed to do? I can’t simply reject the request for an appointment, just because I suspect that the petitioner may not turn up.”

But the biggest problem by far, she says, is the migrants’ attitude towards women, which is so extreme that she has begun to modify her own behaviour in order not to draw unwanted attention.

“It is well known that it is primarily single men who come to us—at least 65 or 70 percent. They are still young, only 20 or so, and not more than 25.

“They simply do not respect women at all. They don’t take us seriously. If I as a woman tell them something or want to take a statement from them, they hardly listen to me at all, or they simply refuse and demand to speak to a male colleague.”

Instead they give her and her female colleagues “contemptuous glances”, or are sexually provocative: one will whistling and make comments in their native language while the others look on and laugh.

“It is really very unpleasant,” she says. “They even photograph us with their smartphones, just like that, without asking, even if you protest against it.”

At first she tried simply ignoring the behaviour, but more recently it has become even more aggressive and intimidating “because in recent weeks there are more and more men from North Africa, from Morocco, Tunisia, or Libya.

They are even more aggressive. I could not ignore it any longer, and I have had to respond,” she continued.

“Specifically, this meant I had to start dressing differently. I’m actually someone who likes to sometimes wear close-fitting items, but not anymore. I now have to wear loose-fitting pants and always high-necked tops. I hardly use any makeup anymore.

“And not only did I have to change my outward appearance to protect myself from this harassment, I also had to alter my behaviour.

“I avoid, for example, going where lots of these single men are staying. If I have to do anything there, I try to get it over and done with as quickly as possible without smiling at anyone so they can’t mistake my intentions.

“But usually I stay in my little office, if possible. And I no longer take the train to work or back, because a colleague was followed by some of the men to the metro station and molested in the train. I would like to spare myself that, and therefore I use my car.”

Clearly ashamed by her changing attitudes towards the migrants, she says: I know this all sounds awful, and I find it terrible myself that I’m doing this, but what can I do?

“The officials are no great help, either with this problem or others that we face – not the Interior Ministry nor the local Federal Office for Migration and Refugees. If you call them they no longer answer the phone.

“I had always ruled out quitting – I like my colleagues very much, and the refugee children. I was previously so convinced of the job and of the whole thing in itself, and it is very difficult to admit that it is all so different from what you have imagined.

“A resignation will be precisely such an admission. But we cannot take it anymore; we cannot bear to see how wrong it all is in here, and, if I’m honest, we cannot change it.”




You tell us that you are on the front line with the gimmigrants Snaark. What is your experience like day to day with this lot?
Im reallly fuclimg pissed but fespite that I can still hit a tarfet at 1000m plus. mayVRVe bnot tonight but it qint beyond the wit if man. Nowhammy.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby seektravelinfo » Wed Jan 20, 2016 11:43 pm

He will say that he has seen nothing of which you speak and has himself had nothing but pleasant experiences and encounters.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby ROB » Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:37 am

seektravelinfo wrote:He will say that he has seen nothing of which you speak and has himself had nothing but pleasant experiences and encounters.


And then we will tell him that he clearly knows nothing about the street on which he lives cos the Guardian / Fox said so.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby nowonmai » Fri Jan 22, 2016 10:50 am

A blow through Aussie immigrant sez they're all wrong, those wrong headed Germans. 1 million isn't a horde, just a useful source of labour and vibrant diversity. Ask Merkel.

Meanwhile you might want to check back with your home country (nicked by my home country, thank me any time you like) and ask the locals Image
how they feel open borders went for them.

Meanwhile the BBC has to admit that things aren't going all that well.

Germany struggling to cope with migrant influx
Katya Adler
Europe editor
3 hours ago
From the section Europe
Migrants queuing to register in BerlinImage copyrightReuters
Image caption
Many Germans feel their country cannot cope with the huge number of new arrivals
Migrant crisis

Turkey 'acting illegally' over Syria refugees
Tightened borders give migrants chill on Europe's frontier
Buongiorno Deutschland! Ciao Italia!
'Jungle' residents' 100-metre move
"I understand that refugees need somewhere safe to go but Germany can't save the world by itself.
"Hopefully this nightmare will soon be over - for them and for us. Then they'll be able to go back to their own homes. And leave ours for good."
It is a journalistic cliché to quote your taxi driver but East German Alexander in his smart Mercedes summed up perfectly the pervading mood in his country.
So I can't ignore him.
He, like most Germans, according to a recent poll by the public broadcaster ZDF, thinks the country cannot cope with the huge amount of refugees and other migrants who have arrived over the last year.
Is Germany attitude to migrants changing?
Manuel Valls: Europe is in grave danger over migration crisis
How Finland is teaching migrants "how to behave"
Concern has spread particularly after the mass sexual assaults by migrants and others on New Year's Eve in the city of Cologne.
Since then, pepper spray, mace and non-lethal gas pistols have been flying off the shelves here.
"You can buy these items legally in Germany," Pavel Svedlov, manager of Berlin's Soldier of Fortune weapons shop told me, "though they are illegal to use against other people. But our clients are more concerned about protecting themselves. That is their priority.
Pepper spray in shop in BerlinImage copyrightReuters
Image caption
Some businesses have now sold out of pepper spray, says one Berlin shop owner
"People are coming to Germany with fake IDs or no papers at all, saying they are refugees. We have no idea who they really are. Many Germans feel it's a ticking time bomb.
"The people who came to our shop used to be young men but now we have a lot of female customers and older people too. We normally offer a choice of 15 different types of pepper sprays for example. Now we've sold out and so have our suppliers."
'Not racist'
Construction worker Matthias told us he'd come to the shop out of concern for his wife.
"I'm not racist," he said, "but ever since the Cologne attacks, I think it's wise for women to carry something with them for self-defence but every shop I've been to has sold out of pepper spray."
Retiree Juergen said he was looking for a gas pistol (it fires a substance similar to tear gas) to keep him safe at home. He said the situation in Germany was getting "worse and worse" and the police were overwhelmed and underfunded.
All this is hugely significant in Germany.
Because of the country's Nazi past, people here tend to be very sensitive about attitudes towards minorities and about the use of weapons - even by their military.
They trusted their government - and Angela Merkel in particular- to provide the stability and security Germans hold so dear. But most Germans now say her migration policy was a mistake.
After flinging open the door a few months ago, Chancellor Merkel is now under public and political pressure, including from within her own conservative CDU/CSU political group, to set an upper limit - as Austria has just done - on the number of newcomers the country will allow in.
After which the government could shout: No more. We're full!
So, will Angela Merkel make such an announcement?
'Huge task'
I couldn't get a straight reply when I asked the state secretary for Germany's Interior Ministry, Emily Haber, but she did say that a single unilateral measure like that wouldn't be enough to stop complex migratory pressures.
She said reducing the number of arrivals was her government's priority: more than one million newcomers came to Germany last year and the country couldn't take one million more in 2016.
But Dr Haber emphasised that, to be effective, all EU partners needed to work together to stop the flow of people to Europe.
In the meantime, the Merkel government has been accused of failing its people by opening the country to "outsiders" without considering the impact fully.
Language class for migrant childrenImage copyrightGetty Images
Image caption
Germany has expanded language classes for migrant children
Dr Haber admitted that integrating the newcomers was "probably one of the hugest tasks my country has faced ever since 1949".
"Many of them don't share the bulk of what any mainstream society would agree on. They come from different backgrounds, they have different views on how to respect women or not. They have different views on how to resolve conflicts, they have different views on how to respect, that we must respect other religions.
"They have different views on what is the historical responsibility of Germany and so forth and that will all have to be factored in and that's a huge challenge."
State-funded language classes are being offered as a first step towards integration but here lies another challenge - the concern among Germany's migrant communities, both recently arrived and well-established, that the criminal behaviour of some in Cologne and elsewhere will now affect them all.
Turkish-German social worker Ercan Yasaroglu, who has lived in Berlin for three decades, is gloomy.
"In one night in Cologne, Germany's welcome culture was destroyed. There's now a new kind of racism here, affecting all of us with a migrant background.
"The danger is, there could then be a backlash amongst some migrants who feel ostracised and angry. Violence breeds violence. But I'm optimistic Angela Merkel can work this out."
We can do this, Mrs Merkel said a few months ago.
But would she repeat that now? The migrant question has thrown the EU into crisis, and even this, its most powerful nation, is struggling to find a way out.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby ROB » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:44 am

nowonmai wrote:thank me any time you like


Why would he thank you? Your forebears stayed at home and did the fucking paperwork.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby snaark » Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:29 pm

ROB wrote:
nowonmai wrote:thank me any time you like


Why would he thank you? Your forebears stayed at home and did the fucking paperwork.


Nowhammy is continuing the tradition of staying at home.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby coldharvest » Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:44 pm

snaark wrote:
ROB wrote:
nowonmai wrote:thank me any time you like


Why would he thank you? Your forebears stayed at home and did the fucking paperwork.


Nowhammy is continuing the tradition of staying at home.

That's where the masturbating is
I know the law. And I have spent my entire life in its flagrant disregard.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby nowonmai » Fri Jan 22, 2016 3:06 pm

Image
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby snaark » Fri Jan 22, 2016 3:42 pm

You seem far too well acquainted with the latest internet trends. Do you ever get up from your computer?
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby seektravelinfo » Fri Jan 22, 2016 10:20 pm

Those Germans. They fold to their collective guilt (in the short term) & open their borders to asylum seekers while they bemoan what the hordes of migrants are doing to their sense of order. I imagine they're pretty nervous. Perhaps they'll go balls to the wall & reopen their work-camps & relight the ovens. It's not like they don't have it in them, 'cause they do.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby rickshaw92 » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:39 pm

The views of a 16 year old girl on this shit.

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/01 ... -facebook/
Im reallly fuclimg pissed but fespite that I can still hit a tarfet at 1000m plus. mayVRVe bnot tonight but it qint beyond the wit if man. Nowhammy.
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Re: nasty insurgency in the heart of Europe

Postby Hitoru » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:45 pm

"The cops tell her she's dumb".
What are you? Some short sighted trigger puller? - RR3 .
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