Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

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Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby svizzerams » Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:38 pm

These guys would qualify as pure comic gold if they weren't threatening so much I hold dear. As a former inhabitant of Harney County I'm appalled at the arrogance and presumption of these sons a bitches.


http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-stando ... ry_package

As we enter Day 24 of the standoff at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, here are the latest developments:

● Grant County sheriff Glenn Palmer said in a statement that freeing a father-son ranching team from prison "would be a start" in ending the standoff. "I just pray to God that cooler heads prevail and that no one gets killed," Palmer said. The sheriff's endorsement of the militants' demands stunned law enforcement officials, most who would not publicly discuss the matter.

● The protesters holding the wildlife refuge had nine ranchers in two states, including an ex-con, renounce their grazing privileges. They promise more will do so in the coming week, a symbolic step toward their avowed goal of shaking federal control of ranchland.

● Occupiers for three weeks have made sweeping demands that local and federal authorities say are both brazen and unrealistic. They want immediate freedom for imprisoned local ranchers. They want federal deeds voided and private owners to take over the property. They want the county to control the refuge. They want federal grazing permits vacated, leaving ranchers free to graze as they choose. And they say they won't go until they get their way. Interviews with lawyers, ranchers, federal authorities and others make clear: Little of what they want is likely to happen.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby Hitoru » Mon Jan 25, 2016 11:12 pm

They can eat the bags of dicks that they were sent along with all the dildos.
http://www.seattlepi.com/local/article/Oregon-occupiers-Quit-sending-us-dildos-6756019.php
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby svizzerams » Tue Jan 26, 2016 2:08 am

I've just signed up for a 4 day photography workshop that takes place in the Malheur Wildlife Refuge and surrounding BLM lands in April. This is my way of protesting their occupation. Bastards. Should I bring my .45?
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby Kurt » Tue Jan 26, 2016 3:29 pm

The thing is I read their backstory and I said "wow, those guys have a good reason to be pissed" but instead of actually doing a type of thing like occupy, state your case to those who may not know it, then leave. They went all cookoo bananas.

What happended was one of the cowboy hatted dudes set a fire on his land to clear brush for grazing. He was arrested for Arson and did 10 months in jail. For Arson on his own land (by its very nature it should have been burning without a permit or something). This was in 2006. Last year a judege reviewed the case, saw he should have gotten a longer sentence and ordered him back to prison for like 4 more years, almost 9 years after he did his time.

If I got that kind of deal 9 years after the fact I would totally lose it. But then it seems they lost site of that original and obvious injustice and moved on to WTF.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby svizzerams » Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:33 pm

These guys are fundie Mormons who hear revelations from god and Captain Moroni. The Hammonds have been a pain in the ass for years, including making threats to BLM/Wildlife personnel - such as "I'll wrap your son in barbed wire and shove him face down into a well". The approximate cost to a rancher in 2015, who grazes on public lands is $1.69 per cow/calf unit (An AUM is the amount of forage needed to sustain one cow and her calf, one horse, or five sheep or goats for a month.) The grazing fee for 2015 is $1.69 per AUM, as compared to the 2014 fee of $1.35. This is a about 6.72% of what it would cost to graze on comparable private land. Even my rancher friends say it is a steal. Cattle operations are heavily subsidized by the American people and we aren't getting much ROI. Nothing noble about what these assholes are trying to achieve. It is pure theater complete with Sumo Wrestlers (http://www.oregonlive.com/geek/2016/01/ ... lleng.html), religious fanatics and stolen valor sociopaths itching to shoot someone and die in a blaze of glory. That said, the sentences imposed on the Hammonds is excessive, but back in the ole lets get tough on crime days the institution of mandatory minimum sentences has put hundreds of thousands of Americans in prison with mandatory sentences for much less than what the Hammonds did. Helping the Hammonds would be to reverse these draconian laws, that also make for a wealthy for-profit prison system that certainly doesn't benefit the American people. The Hammonds were tried and convicted in a court of law,by a jury of their peers, and also plea bargained away some of the charges that would probably have led to a longer sentencing (http://www.justice.gov/usao-or/pr/easte ... ars-prison). So I have some sympathy for them, but they have been dumb asses for years.


http://www.theatlantic.com/national/arc ... e-comments

At the start of the new year, a group of armed protesters stormed the headquarters of a national wildlife refuge in Oregon and claimed it as their base of operations for a standoff against the federal government.

Three weeks later, they’re still out there, and their laundry list of demands hasn’t changed.

The group, led by Ammon Bundy, the son of a Nevada rancher known for his own fight against the feds, is staked out at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in defense of two ranchers whom the protesters say were unfairly treated by the government.

The standoff began in early January in support of two Oregon ranchers convicted three years ago of arson on public lands. Dwight Hammond, 73, and his son Steven Hammond, 43, say they set fire to the land they leased from the government for grazing as a way to get rid of invasive species. The men were sentenced to five years in prison—the mandatory minimum for arson on federal land—but argued that the sentence was unconstitutional. The father served three months and the son one year before being released, but a federal judge ordered them back to prison to serve the remainder of their sentences. The Hammonds turned themselves in to a California prison January 4.

Law-enforcement authorities are still trying to talk Bundy down. Bundy has said he’s going to stay at the refuge until the group’s demands are met—“several months at the shortest.” Bundy’s brother Ryan has reportedly said the protesters are willing to “kill and be killed if necessary.”

The Oregonian reports that the protesters have four demands from the federal government: Release the local ranchers, turn federal lands over to private ownership, void federal grazing permits, and allow Harney County to manage the wildlife refuge, rather than the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

Bundy met briefly with an FBI official on Friday, but left abruptly after some disagreement over the nature of the meeting, according to the Associated Press. The FBI wanted to speak in private, while Bundy wanted the press to be able to look on. A community meeting about the standoff scheduled for Monday was canceled for safety concerns, but it’s unclear exactly what those concerns were.

One rancher in New Mexico and another eight in Utah have pledged to ignore their grazing contracts with the federal government in support of the group’s mission. The lawyer representing the eight ranchers from Utah confirmed their participation in what he called “an act of civil disobedience,” but did not identify them, according to The Oregonian.

The Hammonds have distanced themselves from the standoff since its beginning. A lawyer for the family wrote early on that "neither Ammon Bundy nor anyone within his group/organization speak for the Hammond Family.”

So has Cliven Bundy, the father of Ammon, who held his own standoff against the federal government nearly two years ago. The elder Bundy does not recognize federal control over the land where his cattle graze, and refuses to pay his grazing fees. In 2014, when federal agents started seizing his cattle, Bundy owed $1.2 million to the Bureau of Land Management. According to the Los Angeles Times, he still does.

“I don’t quite understand how much they’re going to accomplish,” Cliven Bundy said about his sons at the beginning of this month. “I think of it this way: what business does the Bundy family have in Harney County, Oregon?”

The website for the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge states the park is closed until further notice.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby gnaruki » Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:40 pm

Sumo wrestler..... As if this circus needed more comic relief:

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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby Hitoru » Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:49 pm

Kurt wrote:The thing is I read their backstory and I said "wow, those guys have a good reason to be pissed" but instead of actually doing a type of thing like occupy, state your case to those who may not know it, then leave. They went all cookoo bananas.

What happended was one of the cowboy hatted dudes set a fire on his land to clear brush for grazing. He was arrested for Arson and did 10 months in jail. For Arson on his own land (by its very nature it should have been burning without a permit or something). This was in 2006. Last year a judege reviewed the case, saw he should have gotten a longer sentence and ordered him back to prison for like 4 more years, almost 9 years after he did his time.

If I got that kind of deal 9 years after the fact I would totally lose it. But then it seems they lost site of that original and obvious injustice and moved on to WTF.


It wasn't his land, it was BLM land, or it spread to BLM land.
Ranchers and miners have been ripping off the tax payers who actually own the land for hundreds of years now. They degrade the the land by overgrazing, causing soil compaction and erosion. The cattle bring in invasive species in their guts and the seeds sprout after they shit. Miners pollute the water, the rivers around Reno NV are polluted with lead and mercury . So you can't eat the fish if there are any.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby Hitoru » Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:51 pm

svizzerams wrote:I've just signed up for a 4 day photography workshop that takes place in the Malheur Wildlife Refuge and surrounding BLM lands in April. This is my way of protesting their occupation. Bastards. Should I bring my .45?

You should always have a firearm with you where allowed.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby nowonmai » Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:32 pm

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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby Kurt » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:41 am

Hitoru wrote:
Kurt wrote:The thing is I read their backstory and I said "wow, those guys have a good reason to be pissed" but instead of actually doing a type of thing like occupy, state your case to those who may not know it, then leave. They went all cookoo bananas.

What happended was one of the cowboy hatted dudes set a fire on his land to clear brush for grazing. He was arrested for Arson and did 10 months in jail. For Arson on his own land (by its very nature it should have been burning without a permit or something). This was in 2006. Last year a judege reviewed the case, saw he should have gotten a longer sentence and ordered him back to prison for like 4 more years, almost 9 years after he did his time.

If I got that kind of deal 9 years after the fact I would totally lose it. But then it seems they lost site of that original and obvious injustice and moved on to WTF.


It wasn't his land, it was BLM land, or it spread to BLM land.
Ranchers and miners have been ripping off the tax payers who actually own the land for hundreds of years now. They degrade the the land by overgrazing, causing soil compaction and erosion. The cattle bring in invasive species in their guts and the seeds sprout after they shit. Miners pollute the water, the rivers around Reno NV are polluted with lead and mercury . So you can't eat the fish if there are any.


OK I can see that. I still think it sucks to notify a guy 9 years after he did time that he has to do more. To me that starts to fall under double jeopardy.

I do know out west their is a tendency to say My Land is my Land and The Government's Land is my land because of wolves and Golden eagles and stuff.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby svizzerams » Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:08 am

This just in: http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/two-peo ... dy-report/

Oregon militant leader Ammon Bundy was taken into custody by federal officials on Tuesday night, the Oregonian reported.

Bundy’s capture was first reported by one of his supporters, Pete Santilli, on a YouTube broadcast. KATU-TV confirmed Bundy’s arrest, adding that three other people were taken into custody. Santilli also stated that two people were shot during the encounter that led to Bundy’s arrest.

YES
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby ROB » Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:22 am

svizzerams wrote:YES


You honestly think that rubbish was worth anyone dying over?
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby svizzerams » Wed Jan 27, 2016 5:00 am

ROB wrote:
svizzerams wrote:YES


You honestly think that rubbish was worth anyone dying over?


No I do not. I am not happy that LaVoy Finicum has died - but they showed up at a Wildlife Refuge with guns, ammo, and some pretty significant religious-fueled delusions and precious little else in preparation (aka 80 item want list that included french vanilla creamer and snacks). Did anyone think this would end in anything but tears? This is what happens when you crowd 7 billion people+ on a planet with finite resources. Welcome to the Anthropocene.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby ROB » Wed Jan 27, 2016 5:58 am

You seem to have some type of "final showdown" scenario in your head.

It's not like they were occupying critical infrastructure. It's not like they took hostages. They were protesting.

Leave them alone.
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Re: Speaking of dumbasses: Sagebrush Rebellion Part deux

Postby nowonmai » Wed Jan 27, 2016 7:36 am

svizzerams wrote:This just in: http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/two-peo ... dy-report/

Oregon militant leader Ammon Bundy was taken into custody by federal officials on Tuesday night, the Oregonian reported.

Bundy’s capture was first reported by one of his supporters, Pete Santilli, on a YouTube broadcast. KATU-TV confirmed Bundy’s arrest, adding that three other people were taken into custody. Santilli also stated that two people were shot during the encounter that led to Bundy’s arrest.

YES


Fuck yeah! Chicken hawk 'liberal' celebrates death of confused old dude! Stay classy sister! Fuck yeah!
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