HEST dive knife

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HEST dive knife

Postby suwon fish » Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:32 am

Even though I think the HEST/F is sexy as hell, it's hard to dislodge the leatherman from my belt.

I was just checking out the DPx gear page. I would love a HEST dive knife. If you are doing a limited edition, put me down for the first run.

RYP, as you know, 99% of life saving scuba knife use is cutting monofilament. Did you think about something like one of those wire-stripping notches, sharp as hell, just for monofilament? I've never seen it but it would be a good idea. I would place it at the choil.

Rope is a common hazard in the water, so a portion of the blade being serrated would be a good idea too. Perhaps one of the serrations could be exaggerated and designated a monofilament cutter... Just thinking out loud.

I would go for shiny rather than matt. If you want to kill folks, just get the SRK. A shiny knife allows you to use it as a flasher to attract fish after cutting up sea urchins. Don't believe me? Try it! You'll find yourself in the middle of a feeding frenzy, cool as hell. One thing, cutting up urchins needs a longer blade.

A shiny finish would also aid with visibility should you drop it, plus your buddy can easily see that you have it in use.

As it has a hollow space you need to think about buoyancy. It has to be negatively buoyant. You don't want to put your tool down, look away for a moment and find it's gone.

Lasty, I put a lanyard on everything. I'd put one on my students if I could ^^ You need a sensibly positioned lanyard hole.

The HEST dive knife could be considerably bigger than the standard HEST. When I travel with spear guns I always allow an hour or so for sitting in a smoky room telling airport cops I'm not a travelling assassin. But if my dive knife is with my dive equipment I have never had anyone look twice at it. Compactness is not necessarily an advantage in a dive knife.

Like many posters, I have a few dives under my belt. Should you want any input or opinion, I would be delighted to help out.
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Woodsman » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:58 am

That is an awesome idea.

5 1/2" blade, 4 1/2" handle. Solid steel.
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby suwon fish » Thu Apr 14, 2011 5:41 am

Woodsman wrote:That is an awesome idea.

5 1/2" blade, 4 1/2" handle. Solid steel.


According to the main site, it's going to be 100% titanium. This as it will be a joint Dive/EOD tool (no rust and non magnetic).

Titanium is lovely stuff, although I'm so tight I've just admired titanium kit owned by others so far. Time for me to tool up ^^
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby JamesInTheWorld » Thu Apr 14, 2011 8:19 am

Woodsman wrote:That is an awesome idea.

5 1/2" blade, 4 1/2" handle. Solid steel.


What would you use it for - diving in your above ground pool?


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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Woodsman » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:15 pm

JamesInTheWorld wrote:
Woodsman wrote:That is an awesome idea.

5 1/2" blade, 4 1/2" handle. Solid steel.


What would you use it for - diving in your above ground pool?

~JITW


The above ground pool is for sale - would your mom let you install it in her basement?
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Woodsman » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:17 pm

suwon fish wrote:
Woodsman wrote:That is an awesome idea.

5 1/2" blade, 4 1/2" handle. Solid steel.


According to the main site, it's going to be 100% titanium. This as it will be a joint Dive/EOD tool (no rust and non magnetic).

Titanium is lovely stuff, although I'm so tight I've just admired titanium kit owned by others so far. Time for me to tool up ^^


Interesting. I wonder if it can keep and hold an edge?
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby suwon fish » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:09 pm

Like I say, I never owned one. I know a few guys with titanium knives and regulators. The reduction in weight for a regulator is amazing (that said, you never notice the weight of a regulator in your mouth in the water...)

Titanium has another interesting property, it reacts with O2 so much these regs are literally eaten by Nitrox (regular air with oxygen added, often 38% O2) and even faster with pure oxygen (sometimes used by tech divers for "off-gassing" at very shallow depths).

I did a search on Blade Forums and they say although titanium has a different character when sharpening, it holds an edge as well or better than steel.

Titanium, an interesting material that I know almost nothing about.
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby RYP » Thu Apr 14, 2011 6:41 pm

thanks for all this

Titanium is actually titanium alloy and you can also sandwich titanium around a harder steel. Beta Titanium is a harder titanium alloy than the usual dross but sharpness and edge holding is a function of hardness and use.
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Woodsman » Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:07 pm

suwon fish wrote:I did a search on Blade Forums and they say although titanium has a different character when sharpening, it holds an edge as well or better than steel.

Titanium, an interesting material that I know almost nothing about.


That is great to know!

Titanium is expensive, highly corrosion resistant, stronger than steel and lightweight. That makes it about the perfect material for using a knife in highly corrosive environments.

The one thing I would be somewhat concerned with is the ability to pry with the knife (which can be an asset while submerged). I would expect titanium to be tad more brittle than steel (though I do not know, it's just a "hunch"), and that would be an expensive one to snap off - and how do you repair that?
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby mapandcompass » Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:13 pm

In addition to Mr. suwon fish's excellent points (which obviously come from a more comprehensive understanding of the tool), I would like to toss in a $0.02 vote for a straight-spined, tanto-tip blade basis.

On the few occasions I've had to dick around underwater with knives, I found "chisel" style stabbing and prying to be great utilities. Obviously not the best design for stabbing a man in the kidneys, but I try to stay out of underwater duels.

Furthermore, I think a straight-tanto blade basis could be particularly beneficial in a titanium blade for two reasons:
1: Titanium, particularly with the buoyancy underwater, will not be noticeably cumbersome even after added bulk
2: Unless I'm mistaken, the tips of most titanium blades leave a bit to be desired in the way of lateral-force durability
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Woodsman » Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:58 pm

Below is an interesting knife, but I like the HEST design a LOT more (aesthetics and practicality are just much better). I can certainly see the appeal of such a knife and I am sure there are a lot of other people out there (with cash burning a hole in their pocket) that see that too.

http://www.scuba.com/shop/display.asp_id_024203

Has anyone ever used one of these Ti knives to pry a mussel off a rock or bend a piece of metal with while submerged? That is what I think I would like to know if I considered purchasing one of these. That they stay sharp better than steel is remarkable.
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Tripton » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:53 am

Woodsman wrote:
suwon fish wrote:I did a search on Blade Forums and they say although titanium has a different character when sharpening, it holds an edge as well or better than steel.

Titanium, an interesting material that I know almost nothing about.


That is great to know!

Titanium is expensive, highly corrosion resistant, stronger than steel and lightweight. That makes it about the perfect material for using a knife in highly corrosive environments.

The one thing I would be somewhat concerned with is the ability to pry with the knife (which can be an asset while submerged). I would expect titanium to be tad more brittle than steel (though I do not know, it's just a "hunch"), and that would be an expensive one to snap off - and how do you repair that?


It isnt really all that expensive. It isnt necessarily stronger than steel, either. It does have a higher strength to weight ratio. It is generally less brittle than steel, in part because it is much softer than steel. Normal titanium alloys are not very wear resistant, and therefore make shitty knives.

In the right circumstances though, and with the right alloy, a decent blade can be made. Just dont expect it to have anywhere near the edge holding of a good steel.
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby JamesInTheWorld » Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:07 am

I have a custom Titanium neck knife, it is sweet and holds a nice edge and has a Rockwell hardness of 59 - it also has a carbide deposit on the back side that actually makes the knife sharper with use, and the carbide adds an additional Rockwell hardness of 71

The key [from what I have been told] is the heat treating, it must be done perfectly

But I was told not to cut plastic or anything really hard or it could chip the blade - but it is more of a collectors item for me

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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby suwon fish » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:24 pm

JamesInTheWorld wrote:I have a custom Titanium neck knife, it is sweet and holds a nice edge and has a Rockwell hardness of 59 - it also has a carbide deposit on the back side that actually makes the knife sharper with use, and the carbide adds an additional Rockwell hardness of 71

The key [from what I have been told] is the heat treating, it must be done perfectly

But I was told not to cut plastic or anything really hard or it could chip the blade - but it is more of a collectors item for me

Image


That's a sweet looking knife, very welcome in the last ditch I'm sure. Nice to have a skull breaking pommel as well as a cutting edge, in a package that's (I imagine) nearly invisible in your hand.

Curious design, does it come from a classic fighting system?
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Re: HEST dive knife

Postby Hitoru » Sun Apr 17, 2011 6:04 pm

it looks like a modern krambit to me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karambit
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